6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

A parents' forum based on GNS (A Good Night's Sleep)
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TorsMamma
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av TorsMamma »

Hi, So tell me how you are doing? How is the food comming along. Better nights?

Keep us posted. :P :D
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Hi Ladies!
I'm back with little Marc with me :)
Sorry for long absence - my mom came to see us for a while then we came to see our friends and I literally didn't have a minute to post.
All this time Marc didn't sleep well. In good nights he waked up at least 3 times per night (1 for breastfeed), in the morning he finally waked up in 1-1,5 hrs earlier the scheduled time, didn't sleep all naps long etc.
It seem so wrang, he asked his questions for hours and I thought that my son was special and any method didn't work for him. I became more flexible with the schedule and sometimes even come to stroke him to settle him down at nights. And it worked! But... Uuuuf. I must say that things became even worse now, he waked up 5-6-7 times at night and didn't sleep for hours.
so I've decided to start with cure from the scratch and eliminate breasfeeding at night.
Do you have special recommendations for this case? Should I change the jingle or so on?
I need you special advice re. The schedule. We have something like this for the moment:
21 - 7.20 night with 6 wake-ups and 1 breatsfeeding). Marc usually wakes up by his own at this time exactly
8 - breastfeeding
9 - breakfast. 100g of fruit and vegetables
10 - 10.45 nap 45 min (it's ok usually)
12 - meal. 100g of fruit and vegetables + breastfeeding
13.30 - 16.00 walk in the carriage. 2 hrs of sleep, 0,5 hrs of wakefulness
16 - meal. 100g of formula (fermented milk) + breastfeeding
18 - 18.45 nap. Usually 5-20 mins, sometimes doesn't sleep at all
19 - meal. 200 ml of liquid porridge and breastfeeding if he likes
20 - Bathing
21 - last portion, breastfeeding

Do you think the food is enough? He is not big eater still and it takes me a lot of patience to make him eat his 100g of vegetables :( better with liquid food. I have doubts but will to eliminate breastfeeding at nights.

He is 8,5 now. Crawling but not creeping yet. He spend all his time on the floor moving and playing with his toys. Right now we are in the middle of massage cure.

I'm really sorry that I have shown weakness but the result was not satisfying. Please give me a hope that it could happen this time.
TorsMamma
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Blev medlem: fre 17 nov 2006, 09:25
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

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Hi again, :D

So we are pushing the “reset button”? Just have in mind that the cure might take a bit longer than the first time you do it.

I believe (I think I told you as well) that when you give food at night they get confused and wonder what is up each time they wake up. So you really need to be consistent and follow the book down to the letter this time. 2 weeks of no plans but to set the cure I think is the way to go. No appointments or travels.

So he is in the middle of the 8 month anxiety period right now. You can read more about this in the FTLOC book. This is a time when the world needs to be secure and predictable. So stick to your schedule and lots of closeness during the day. So you can sleep at night.

Also I think you are right, you really need more food. Normally a 8 month old will eat 200 gr of food (with meat, fish or chicken) and 100-200 gr of fruit on top of that. Nomally as well they have a period where they eat on their own. What we call picking food. Like tiny pieces avocado, corn, peas, sandwich, egg/omelet, potato pieces with butter, pasta over cooked and so on. So keep up the feeding.

Let me give you a schedule. You have too short nights, it needs to be longer. The amount to sleep over 24 hours for an 8 month old is 14.5 hours and 9-11 months is 14 hours. I also think it is time to go over to 2 naps a day. One short in the morning and one longer during the day.

20-07.30 Night without food!
7.30 - breastfeeding
8.00 - breakfast. Sandwich and oatmeal/porridge 200gr
9.30 - 10.15 nap 45 min
10.30 – Outside crawling and checking things out.
12.00 - meal. 200g of fruit and vegetables with meat + breastfeeding (breastfeeding AFTER food and all within 60 min)
13.00 - 15.00 sleep in the carriage without walking.
15.30 - snack. 100g of formula (fermented milk) + breastfeeding
16.00 – Outside looking at the trees and forrest.
18.00 – dinner with the family meal. Vegetables with meat/egg with fruit and breastfeeding if he likes
19.00 - Bathing
19.30 - last portion, breastfeeding or fluid porridge.
20.00 night.

So you can use the same jingle but you need to review some chapters. First the safari chapter (in the English book) page: 41 This to understand what went wrong.
Then reread the chapters Peace, security and enjoyment. So you have a plan.

Print the cheat sheet and put on the door…

http://www.annawahlgren.com/index.php/v ... heat-sheet

More info for you if you need inspiration.

http://www.annawahlgren.com/index.php/v ... d-children

Get back to me and we can keep planning before you get started. Preparation is the key here! Like studying for your driverslicence. :wink:
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Thank you for your patience and endless support. Sure I remember your warnings re. night food. I just hope that this was an issue.

You are completely right that I have to be prepared well before start. So I have loooots of questions :)
1. 20-7.30 is too early for our life style. Do you think it is possible to split in an hour? Or not possible as he tends to wake up at this time. Some times he sleeps till 8 or so ...

2. Isn't 2 hrs gap between sleeps in the morning too short? And 5 hrs in the evening not too long?

3. It's difficult to have day sleep in cartridge right now. We live in block house and do not have a terrace or balcony and it's too cold yet to stay outside with carriage. So we have to walk. But in a month or two we are going to move to cottage and it would be nice to learn him asleep in stable carriage/crib. What do you suggest? May be try to have day nap in the crib? But he usually doesn't sleep more then 45 mins at home and so long gap to night will be too long
TorsMamma
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Blev medlem: fre 17 nov 2006, 09:25
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

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Hi,

I’ll try to answer your questions.

1. Perhaps if you postpone the schedule by 30 min it would work for you? But it is as I’ve said before quite uncommon that children sleep later than 7.30 from my perspective.
2. Normally when you have 3 naps the last nap “falls” off naturally when they don’t sleep it. And the hours before the night gets longer. Then the morning nap will “fall off” and left is the midday nap. So no I don’t think so. It is about what my son had. It will work.
3. OK, so now you keep walking, but I had the long nap in the crib, window open and still PITCH dark. You should not be able to see your hand in front of you. Then he will most likely sleep better during the day and at night. Here in Sweden we put garbage bags on the window that are black.

So PITCH dark is a must, otherwise you are asking for trouble. And more food so they last through the night. It is what you eat during the whole day, not before bedtime that counts. So every little bit is good.

I understand that we don’t have the same lifestyles, however just as an example. In the summer vacation (all of july) all the children here in Sweden are up to lets say 22-23 in the evening. And if the parents are lucky the children will sleep until 8.00 in the morning. That means that they only get 9-10 hours of sleep/day during summer vacation. They get deprived of sleep! :cry:
But the children here that has gone through the cure and follow the FTLOC book we keep our schedules for our children knowing they are happy and glad during the day and not cranky and tired.
We adjust our lifestyle somewhat to our children. WE try to compromise and live together. So perhaps you can think what you do is for your child? He can sleep in the carriage when you are away and just walk home. I when we visited friends I would bring a travel bed and put in a bedroom. A sheet over the bed and put my son to bed the same time as home. That’s how we compromise. He is not even up late on new year’s eve or Christmas or any other holiday. He’s 5.5 years now.

Keep reading the book. You can do this!
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

So we will postpone by 30 mins. For sure I'm ready to adjust our lifestyle for the child but not all is possible. Our father come back from work only at 20.00 and so will do I when come back to work. 20.30 go to bad means only 30 mins with baby in best case :(

I will also re-read the main chapters of the book, but could you please tell me - how can we be sure that safari comparison is correct? Who knows what do children fill and think? It's still a big question for me ... Sorry to say.

One thing in the cure is not clear enough: should I step in with jingle as soon as He wakes up? Or let him settled down by his own first?

What do you mean by "sandwich"? Is it a peace of bread with something :?
TorsMamma
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Blev medlem: fre 17 nov 2006, 09:25
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av TorsMamma »

Hi,

I understand, even here in Sweden parents complain that they don’t get to see their children enough. But if they don’t sleep more during the day, you will have to do it at night instead. The sleep needed is the same using any method that I have tried. (and I'm educated in more sleeping methods than GNS, and another 3, they all have the same amount of sleep)

With regards to the Safari, if you don’t get that or believe in it then it is difficult to have the proper attitude with the cure. :cry: Because everything is based on this theses. Even the tiniest of babies know that if they are left alone their lives are put on the line.

You can read this from this psychologist written where he has the same theory but not the same solution.

http://www.annawahlgren.com/forum/viewt ... 31#p296031

So if you don’t believe in it you will surely have difficulties in doing the cure. I truly understand the issue then.

In the first 3 nights you follow the cheat sheet. First night buffing and second night the jingle at first sound, third night you can wait and see if it is only tiny noise, but if there is a question in there, then you need to answer it with a jingle. So what is the question? Mommy, are you there? Yes son, I’m standing watch for you. Secure and robust jingle. BIG question, Do I really sleep on my own, CAN I do this? Yes son, you can do this. ( all in the jingle words, but using you tone differently) Strong Happy jingle.
The jingle is always a minimum of X4 and you do the confirmation jingle separately the first 3-4 nights, if the jingle works, then you can use the jingle with the confirmation on the last X1. So X3 a loud happy great jingle and the last X1 soft and gentle.

Sandwich = a piece of soft bread with butter or anything else on top, cut into tiny squares they can pick using their little fingers.

Keep reading and keep asking.
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Dear TorsMamma, thank you for all your advices and lots of unique information you give to me. I do not want to seam ngratefull or bad - I just have doubts and questions like our children :)

I've read through the article you gave me and truly believe in concept of children fears. But author's advice is contrary to our cure - to put child in adults bad or to calm him at least - "any crying baby needs to be picked up, held close, and cared for". And this is the point I have concerns with :( right now we can calm Mark down with putting him on his side or repositioning him in the crib. It's not a panacea and he wakes up too much but still ... What if he need my help, my participation? Or he is just thirsty? Whatever ... :(

However I am firm to re-start with cure in a few days as soon as we finish with massage cure. What do you mean by "no appointments" for at least two weeks. I understand that we should stay at home or just walk together and keep our schedule stable. No visits. And no visitors? It could be an issue as we have a lot of friends that usually come to se us at weekends.
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Also I have a question re new schedule. Apparently it's a time to have 2 naps only but he never sleeps 2 hours in a row - only 1 or 1,5 in a walk. May be it would be better when he start to enjoy sleeping [-o< but if not, whouldnt he be too tired in the evening?

I've offered him tiny slices of banana today served on a small plate. He Wanted to test the plate only not banana :)
TorsMamma
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Blev medlem: fre 17 nov 2006, 09:25
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

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Hi,

Ok you can have visitors as long as you keep the schedule down to the minute and can keep your attitude up while people are there to do the jingle and so on. But you also need to have a fairly calm life. Don’t want them over stimulated. Then they never sleep as they should.

The only advise I have is if you don’t meet the need of sleep during the day then you need longer nights. The total amount of sleep needed is not any less for children in Russia compared to Sweden. :wink:

Yes, the authors solution is not the same as ours, but in a sence it is. We let our children know that we are present by making noise and jingle. That is what you use to make him secure, this works since I have done it, seen it and heard it from hundreds of children by now. If you don’t understand or believe this I would say, don’t do the cure. Co-sleep until you believe different.
I will not make this a convincing matter. Perhaps you could contact Lena K again through pm and she can explain this to you easier than I can?

Keep reading the book, over and over again. The more you read the more you will understand, I’m sure. It is not a technique to do, it is a philosophy, a way of life. :heart:
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Ok, reboot.

It was our first night today - without food :) he waked up three times: 23.30 for 5 mins, 2.30 for 2 hrs, 6.30 for 20 mins. I've used jingle only to settle him down. It's pretty common situation. I true believe that second night would be much better :)

I'd like to clarify what I supposed to do in the morning if he wakes up in 30 min earlier target time - try to settle him down with the jingle? And if in 15 mins or less earlier - waked him up immediately or wait for target time?

Re food: I've add a little cookies for breakfast, yellow/wight egg for lunch. It seams that he is not ready for picking pieces, I would try to offer it further. What is the size of pieces - 3x3 or 8x8 mm?
TorsMamma
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Blev medlem: fre 17 nov 2006, 09:25
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av TorsMamma »

Hi,

Cool, good luck with the cure! :D

So to your questions.

If my child woke up 30 min before waking up time I would do nothing if possible because a jingle would just say, morning is here. If they wake up 15 min before do happy morning. It is important that the morning is like it is their birthday! :lol:

There is something in the U.K. called “Baby Led Weaning” do a search on Google and you get many hits. There they give the children FULL SIZE food. A whole corn on the cob, a whole sandwich and so on, so size doesn’t matter, they need to be able to pick it up.
But the pieces I used for my son was probably closer to 8x8 mm. This before I read about BLW which I think is just great, and combined with pure perfect.

Second night will be better. Just remember the confirmation jingle! :wink:

Good luck tonight!
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Thank you! I believe I'm master of jingle - I've been repeat it already for 2 months ;)

The size of pieces is question mark for me ... It could be dangerous for baby he can't swallow. What BLW says about it? Let's see :)
TorsMamma
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Blev medlem: fre 17 nov 2006, 09:25
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Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

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You'll do great.

Perhaps you want to go a first aid course for babies so you know the heimlich for babies. I did!

Good luck with the cure and all the great new food to introduce. You can give pieces of corn, peas, chickpeas that you peel. They mush it in their mouth!
Tor 2006
:heart: BB barn från början. Sov sin första 12h natt 5 dagar före 4 mån, Diplomerad SS vid 6 mån
:heart:

:heart: FTLOC child from the beginning. Slept his first 12 hour night 5 days before 4 months. :heart:
Leenkin1
Inlägg: 49
Blev medlem: fre 13 jan 2012, 15:04

Re: 6-months baby-boy form Russia: day routing

Inlägg av Leenkin1 »

Hi,
We are on 6th night of the cure now and I have to admit that this is just amazing. It works!!! Unbelievable ;) For 4th night Marc slept all night long - 11 hours in a raw! Wow! I used to dream only about such nights :))))
But not all our nights and naps are such excellent. Unfortunately. He still wakes up in the middlle of night and talk for an hour or so, or wakes up in an hour earlier in the morning and insists on immediate waking. I keep coming with jingle every 15 mins. Should it become better? I read in the book that it could take weeks.
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